The biggest electric system trick of all is to have as  little system as you can get away with. Electrical systems are easy to install,  which invites overkill. You’ll regret it later, though, because problems are  more likely to arise and harder to diagnose in a complicated system. If I were  doing all this over, I would simply buy portable LED bicolor and stern navigation  lights and have it done with. These are simple, inexpensive, efficient, and  they will fit all of your boats! Take  careful note of this last point.  
              In fact, if you’re smart, you’ll skip the rest of the  article and buy a set. Trust me, it will save you a lot of work. 
              Still reading, eh? Well, I guess you’re one of the dumb  ones. Welcome to the club.  
              My starting point for this system should have been a clue to  me that I should get portable lights. I had a bow light installed pretty well  on the schooner, but the 360 degree light was screwed to a makeshift mast made  from a scrap 2x2. There was no good way to hold it vertical. I had a pair of 6v  lantern batteries clunking around unfastened in a compartment. I swear to you  that this project was on the list, but a stern rebuke from the local water cops  made it a higher priority.  
              At this point, the choice was to get a simple system or  further complicate the one I had. Naturally, I complicated. 
              Battery Box 
              I probably shouldn’t even tell you this part of the story,  since I think it’s a bad idea. But I suppose some of you will insist on a more  elaborate electrical system, so let’s look at some things I did wrong. 
              Legally, the battery needs to be fastened to the hull, and  the terminals need to be covered. I built a box to house the batteries and  switches, and mounted it inside a compartment. This meant it had to be cleverly  designed to fit through the hatch and still be able to mount solidly to the  hull and be handy to use. I don’t  think I really achieved the latter, since I had to reach into the compartment  to operate switches or charge the batteries. Worse, if I capsized the entire  system would be very difficult to open up to dry it out. This would be an even  bigger deal for folks on saltwater. 
              
              
                
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              I finally realized that my mistake was in making it permanently attached. Keeping it all in  one box was actually sort of smart. But if the whole assembly could be  unclamped, it would be easier to charge and work on inside the shop, I wouldn’t  need to carry it at all for daysailing, and I could also use it on other boats!  This should have been obvious, since these points are make outboard motors so  attractive.  
              Here’s the new removable box. It can strap down under the  thwart in the rear cockpit when needed. This allows the switches to be under  cover too.  
              
              Here’s an unforeseen advantage: the box also serves as a  remote auxiliary power supply! It supplies power to three circuits with a 4-pin  flat trailer connector, but most of the time I’m using the accessory jack. It  is a very handy place to plug in a  12v air mattress pump! This allows a midnight  top-up when you have that elusive leak, but without operating a manual pump or dragging  the bed to the truck.  
              It can also run a CB radio or other accessories without  running down the truck’s starting battery. Or when the tow vehicle has a wiring  failure and I’m too tired to fix it, I can at least get the trailer lit up  without too much fuss. Maybe I should add an auto flasher relay for one of the  outputs to make hazard lights easy too.  
              I guess the most important message here is that I find this  box useful, but mostly for non-boat jobs. Let’s look at some details. 
              Charging the  Batteries 
              The easiest way to charge the batteries is to make a cable  with two cigarette lighter plugs. I guess now they call them 12v accessory  plugs. Connecting the car’s jack to the box’s jack while driving will charge  the batteries. Make sure the battery switch is set to “both”, so both batteries  get charged. Unless, of course, you know one battery is already fully charged. Make absolutely sure you have tip connected  to tip, and ring to ring!!! And be sure the accessory circuit has a fuse in  case you screw up.  
              Of course many trips aren’t long, and charging SLA batteries takes time. You’ll want a way to charge  them without running the tow vehicle in the driveway for hours on end. This is  easy. Connect the same accessory plug to a pair of screws through a scrap of  plywood. 
                
              And in use… 
                
              Bear in mind that you can’t get a good test of a battery’s  state of charge until you let it sit for three hours or so, or power something  for a few minutes to drain off the “surface charge.” Find way more than you  ever wanted to know at www.batteryfaq.org/ and www.batteryuniversity.com.  
              Let’s look at what’s inside the power box.  
              Fuse panels 
              I really tried to find an ultra-cheap approach to a fuse  panel and switches. I actually did build something from parts taken from a  conversion van in the junkyard. But it was so bulky and ugly I took it apart even  before I photographed it. For the price, I couldn’t beat the metered fuse panel  Duckworks sells. I bet you know how painful it is for me to admit that kind of  defeat.  
              But Chuck knows I’m an electrical gear junkie and cheered me  up by adding a cool Bakelite dual battery switch to his lineup. I had been  planning to simply disconnect spade terminals on the batteries, but the switch  is much more convenient. Battery switches  really clean up a rat’s nest of wire. Now the wires don’t move and the switches  are easy to find by feel.  
                
              Where I failed, Eric Larson succeeded. He came up with a  pretty good el-cheapo switch box. This is a small discount store utility box  and common household light switches. He even stuck in a little accessory fuse  block. Here it is removed while I was remodeling the hull.  
              
              Eric included switches for bow and stern light, as well as a  built-in searchlight. I think I would always prefer a powerful flashlight for  that function, as I could use it elsewhere. The pushbutton switch is for the  built-in horn.  
              All in all it’s not a bad setup, and better if mounted to a  portable battery. One could do the battery switching with two common light  switches as well.  
              On the other hand, I think it would cost $15-20 for the  parts if you didn’t have them laying around. For an extra $5-10 the ready-made gets  you an accessory jack and two-battery switchable charge meter. That charge  meter is terribly convenient and saves me bringing my nice multimeter in the  boat. I guess I would base this decision on the contents of your junk box. 
              Battery Box  Bottom Line 
              I think I’ve reduced the inconvenience to the practical  minimum in this battery box system. But I hope I have illustrated how easy it  is to overcomplicate electrical systems. Resist the temptation! Get the minimum  necessary and keep it interchangeable among boats. 
              That brings us to the lights themselves. 
              Light Testing 
              Of course I had the cheapest lights available. Chinese  industry isn’t exactly known for looking out for the safety of Americans, so I  decided I’d better test whether I was actually legal. 
    
                On vessels under 12 meters (pretty much all of us), the  sidelights have to be visible a mile distant, the all-around light 2 miles. As  I mentioned above, unpowered vessels under 7 meters can opt out and display a  flashlight “in time to prevent a collision”. But notice that this places the  burden of proof on the person with the flashlight. The lawyer for the  inattentive clod in the big powerboat will say it wasn’t “in time” if there was  a collision. And obviously boats like ours are going to fare badly in any  collision, so we want to be highly visible.  
              For this sort of testing you need two people and cell phones  or two-way radios. You could get away with two big flashlights and a code  system, if you need to. You also need GPS or a map to tell you how to come up  with locations that are one and two miles distant. One location could be on  shore, but I suspect it is important that the lights are viewed over water. We  see differently when reflections are involved.  
              This process is much easier when the lights are off the  boat. Look at scaled map of your local water and figure out shore access points  that are one and two miles away across the water. This lets you do this kind of  thing when it is too cold for boating to be much fun at night. It also doesn’t  take nearly as long. Even if you’re doing this in a boat, choosing spots along shore  can help you figure out your distances without GPS. 
                
              If you live in Wisconsin,  you’re in luck. The Department of Natural Resources provides free scaled  hydrographic maps for most lakes on their website.  
              On the water 
              My local outboard motor contact and I made an outing of this  event, since he wanted to test his lights too. It was a perfect night for it,  too – 55 degrees (warm for October), almost no wind and a clear sky with first  quarter moon. We all got in my boat and headed across the lake to land them at  the park where they would be watching from shore. Then I headed out to a  position one mile away with no backlighting. My incandescent bicolor light, and  Dale’s incandescent portable were visible to both Dale and his friend. My LED  portable was visible only to his friend.  
              Then I proceeded to the two-mile position. All of the white  lights were visible to both sets of eyes, including the LED light. Only my  incandescent was dim but visible, but it came back strong when I switched to a  fresh battery. 
              I was worried that the bicolor LED light might have had low  batteries to account for its less-impressive performance. But no, all its  batteries read 1.462 volts. On the other hand, I must have put mismatched,  half-used batteries in the white LED light, because they read 1.253, 1.266,  1.466 and 1.252! Yet this light was quite bright! I guess the lesson here is  that the white light makes better use of fading batteries, probably because  there are no filtering losses. The other lesson is that the LED bicolor is  legal, if just barely.  
              The interesting point was that running the incandescent  bicolor for only a short time depleted the battery to where it was very  noticeable on the test of the white light a short time later. The difference I  measured after the fact was 12.08 and 12.47 volts. This was another clue that I  my initial approach was wrong. I had started out with fresh batteries, and they  were draining fast!  
              Incandescent Bulb  Challenges 
              This precipitous drop in battery voltage would have been  predictable if I’d done a small amount of math beforehand. Here’s an example.  
              My bow light had an unmarked festoon bulb with a resistance of  2 ohms. Divide the battery’s 12 volts by this resistance and we get its current  draw – 6 amps. Multiply this by the voltage and we get its power rating – 72  watts. This same trick works for any incandescent bulb you can measure the  resistance of, since they should have similar efficiency characteristics. The  white incandescent light is 1.0 ohm, 12 amps and 144 watts.  
              With incandescent lights we can expect to draw around 18  amps underway, 12 amps at anchor. Remember those amperages as we discuss… 
              Rechargeable  Batteries 
              Battery capacity is rated  in Amp-hours (Ah), which is a measurement of how many hours a battery can  provide 1 amp. Unfortunately this is not linear. A battery rated for 5 Ah will  probably last much less than an hour at a 5 amp discharge rate. (It might also  get ruined!) It might also last longer than 10 hours at ½ amp. So ideally we  also want to see the battery’s specs to glean the recommended discharge rate. It is only at this rate that the  specified amp hour figure applies.  
              Since we’re talking about discharge characteristics, we’d  better look at battery types. I am focusing on rechargeable batteries, because  18 amps of disposable battery power cannot ever be remotely cost-effective.  
              Auto Batteries 
              The first rechargeable battery we’re all going to think of  is one of the old automotive batteries we have sitting around in the garage. Unfortunately,  these are terrible for our needs. First, auto batteries are designed for  producing large jolts of current for a short time to turn a starter motor, then  being immediately recharged. Deep discharge physically damages the paper-thin  lead matrix needed to produce that big jolt. Second, they are much heavier than  they need to be. And third, they can leak. I don’t really want sulfuric acid  leaking into the bottom of my boat, do you? What would I do? Pump water in to  dilute it, then pump it back overboard, all while clinging to a mast and hoping  nothing important dissolves? That doesn’t sound fun. 
              NiCd Cordless Tool Batteries 
              Most of us have one of these somewhere, which makes us think  it might be good to use it. The good news is they are designed to tolerate a  deep discharge pretty well, and recharge fast. But most of these units are 1.2  Ah. Some nicer ones are 1.8 Ah. Remember those amperages above? We’re looking  at 18 amps to light our two lights, so you’d need 10 tool battery packs to last  an hour. I know I don’t have that many.  
              NiMH Batteries 
              Nickel Metal Hydride batteries are great in a  walkman, but we again run into trouble with our current and voltage needs.  HERE is the spec sheet we mentioned above. 
              The recommended discharge is .9-2.7 amps, which presents a  problem. Remember that 18 amp demand? We’d need 7 banks of batteries in  parallel. Worse, we need 12 volts and these are 1.5, so we have to stack 8 of  them in series. That’s 56 expensive batteries. How would you charge them all?  You’d have a box of batteries waiting in line for the charger at home. Also,  there is no good way to charge them when you’re camping, since NiMH batteries  need special charging circuitry to charge correctly.
Sealed Lead Acid (SLA) 
              Sealed lead acid (SLA)  batteries are a different story. These are just as easy to use as any other  lead-acid battery, but can’t spill. They also have a very low self-discharge  rate, which equates to a good shelf life in your boat. This lets you forget  about them all winter. HAM Radio folks are serious about batteries, so you can  find a lot of information at www.hamuniverse.com/batteries.html.  
              I found on www.batterymart.com a 12v, 7 Ah battery for $10. That beats every other option I’ve found including  trailer breakaway batteries, electric fence batteries, and rechargeable lantern  flashlight batteries. There are larger Ah capacity batteries, but you don’t  necessarily get more Ah per dollar. For example, the 35 Ah version costs $40,  which is $5 more than 5 of the 7 Ah version. But wherever you order them, be  sure to check the shipping cost before clicking “buy”! Lead acid batteries are heavy! 
              But still we have trouble. SLA  batteries are generally rated for a 20 hour discharge cycle. So that 7 Ah  battery is really meant to provide .35 amps over 20 hours, and a faster rate of  discharge will shorten battery life. This is a good length of time for nav  lights, but it also means we should have 57 batteries in parallel for 18 amps!  
              Incandescent lights sure soak up a lot of power, don’t they?  I guess we’d better look at alternatives. 
              LEDs 
              Everyone has heard about how efficient LEDs are. But I’ve  seen some claims that make no sense at all. For example when they tell you how  many watts a light assembly soaks up,  some of that power is heating up a resistor instead of making light. Worse,  it’s not predictable. How much power goes to the resistor depends on the  relationship between the system voltage and the voltage the LED wants, as well  as how many LEDs you run in series. So you can’t translate watts to lumens in a  predictable way. You have to know some electronics and do some math to make a  reasonable guess as to power consumption vs. light output. For most of us, I  think we are better off to rely on testing on the water as discussed above. 
              The other trouble with LEDs is that the powerful LEDs have  narrow angles, so you need a lot of them or you need a fancy reflector. This  makes it cost a bit to build a light. (Gary Blankenship tells you all about how  to do it HERE.   It might cost you $20-30 in parts, but as we saw above, the savings in  batteries is tremendous. Let’s take a look at that. 
              First we should look at the requirements. COLREGS states  that we need 0.9 candela (Cd) to be visible at one mile, and 4.3 Cd at 2 miles.  (I’d like to thank the Coast Guard for doing that math for us!) They also  caution us to avoid causing excessive glare with overpowered lights. But I  cannot believe this would present a problem as long as we stay in the range of  the next vessel size up. Vessels 12-20 meters are required to have side lights  visible at 2 miles and stern and all-around lights visible at 3 miles (12 Cd).  At worst we would be seen as a larger vessel, perhaps deserving of more  respect.  
              It is handy that we know the requirements in Cd, since most  LEDs are rated that way. As long as the LED meets the spec and is aimed  directly at its target, the goal will be met.  
              If I were building an LED light from scratch, I’d use the  direct method. For example, I might use a white LED capable of 8 Cd that needs  3.5 volts and draws 90 mA. It covers 45 degrees, so I’d need 8 of them. Three  in series would need 10.5 volts, so I’d need a resistor to bring the voltage  down to that. The remaining two would need the voltage taken down to 7 volts.  There’s a calculator at www.superbrightleds.com to figure this out. 
              We end up with a light of 8 Cd that draws 2.7 amps. This is  not a tiny draw, but it’s about 4.5x better than the 12 amps of its  incandescent counterpart. This squares with the general notion that LEDs are  approximately 5x more efficient than incandescent lamps – a good sanity check. 
              The savings are more pronounced with the bicolor light. An  incandescent lamp loses around 70% of its power in filtering. LEDs start out  making the right color. Even if you still put a filter in front of it, losses  are minimal. My incandescent that tested correctly at one mile draws 6 amps. An  LED bicolor at 8 Cd might use around 0.6 amps. So when filtering is involved,  we can probably expect colored LEDs to be about 10x more efficient.  
              Our real world testing supports these numbers. Both LED  lights are built exactly the same, only the bicolor has a colored diffuser. So  the white light was plainly visible at two miles with weak batteries. The  bicolor was barely visible at one mile with good batteries, so we know it lost  more than 50% of its power in filtering. Perhaps close to that 70%. 
              Batteries  requirements with LEDs 
              Now our current draw at 12 volts is 3.6 amps total. Looking  at the battery capacities above, a couple NiCd tool batteries could do the job  for a short outing, but we really ought to have 10 SLA  batteries for long battery life. Unless of course you’ve gotten smart by now  and gotten self-contained portable lights. It’s easy to recharge eight (or 16)  NIMH AA batteries.  
              Is it starting to seem like I’m harping on this? Probably.  So I guess I’d better talk about how I’m using those LED lights now. 
              Portable Nav Light  Mountings 
              As is often the case, things aren’t as simple as they should  be here, mostly because I have a bowsprit. 
              Bow Light Mounting 
              Here’s the new and the old on the schooner. The old one is  just in front of the eye bolt. 
                
              The original installation looks very professional, but I am  pretty sure the jib boom blocks the light to lee when heeled. With the LED  light I don’t have to worry. A simple 1x3 spar gets the lamp well out in front  of the bowsprit.  
                
                
              It is held on with the cleated line so it can be removed  from inside the cockpit when approaching piers and other unyielding objects.  Those of you who are smarter than me won’t have to worry about this, because  you will have sensible lug rigs devoid of nonsense like jibs and bowsprits. 
              Mounting the same lamp on the AF4B looks like this. Yes, I  have the fancy teardrop side lights, but I won’t be using them unless I both to  rebuild them with LEDs. By the way, these portable lights mount with M6 1.00  screws, so go straight to metric section.  
                
              The mounting is obviously pretty simple – two pieces of  aluminum strap pop riveted together. Two screws mount it to the stempost when  needed. I leave the screws in the holes in the stem when not in use, so water  doesn’t collect there. The only change I plan is switching to Phillips screws  so I can mount and remove the bracket with a cordless drill. 
              One thing that worries me a little is that I’m pretty sure  the bicolor can be seen aft of where it should be visible. But the pattern gets  pretty spotty in that area, so I’m hoping the manufacturers know what they’re  doing and are counting on the intensity being insufficient to cause any  confusion. 
              360 degree light 
              After fussing with that bowsprit mess, this mounting is  quite easy. It is a piece of stair railing with a plywood baffle mounted on L  brackets. The lamp screws to both plywood and railing, and the railing steps  into a pair of U-bolts on the inside of the transom. I thought about using pole  clips, but this member needed to be solid, as it also sometimes serves as a  handhold when climbing aboard. Just don’t forget about it when going under a  low bridge!  
                
              
              By the way, I made it that tall so the light can still be  seen with the bimini up. This is handy when it rains and also seems better for  maintaining night vision in the cockpit.  
              Stern Light 
              When sailing we need a different sort of light. The white  light should be screened from the sectors covered by red and green. We do this  by constructing a screen to block the light forward of 22.5 degrees aft of the  beam. The interior needs to be flat black, and I didn’t both with anything  beyond primer on the rest of it. Not shown is the lid, which is needed to  reduce glare out the top. 
                
              A coffee can does the job here, held accurately in place by  being bolted against the coaming. It is easiest to get this right with a box  jig similar to what we used to adjust the retro style side lights in a previous  article.  
                
              Nice and simple. But if I start the motor, I have to unscrew  the light and move it to the 360 degree mount.  
              I guess the bottom line of all this is to keep it simple,  and seriously consider LEDs. I’m glad I built the battery box, but not because  of boating. I think you will have all the light you need on a boat with a pair  of LED nav lights, an LED head lamp, and a powerful lantern flashlight or  similar self-contained spotlight.  
              Rob Rohde-Szudy 
                Madison,   Wisconsin, USA 
  robrohdeszudy@yahoo.com    
             
             
            Addendum: 
            Electrical System Tricks – Error!!! 
            Welcome to the department of retractions, corrections and  other screw-ups. I had a slightly uneasy feeling about the Electrical System  Tricks Article, sort of like I had forgotten something. Well, it turns out I  did, and Gaétan Jetté in Canada  was kind enough to point out my error.  
            I’ll bet those amperage figures under “Incandescent Bulb  Challenges” seemed really high to you. They did to me too and I should have  known why. I was relying on cold filament resistances, but these  increase quite a lot when heated to incandescence.  
            I really should have thought of this, since this is exactly  why lamps are used to protect audio speakers in high power applications. A  carefully chosen lamp in line with the speaker will normally act as a low value  resistor and not do much at all. But when it gets enough current to light up,  its resistance jumps much higher. This in turn reduces the current, providing a  really cheap limiter.  In fact my bass  amplifier is so equipped! (I guess it’s been a while since I’ve had to play  that loud…) 
            Let’s take a walk through what this means for our boatier  purposes. 
            New Measurements
            Measuring the hot resistance takes a little more doing than  the cold resistance. One approach is to skip the resistance and measure the  amperage directly. Most people don’t have a big enough ammeter to get a useful  reading. I didn’t until I dug through a box of electrical parts I had forgotten  I had. Lo and behold, I had the perfect meter on hand all along! So I wired it  up in series with my battery box and a few lights. 
            
              
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            As it turns out, the bicolor light draws around one amp hot  (not six) and the anchor light draws around 1.5 amps hot (not 18). (It looks  like the meter is reading about 2.6 amps, but it was not at zero when  unloaded.) Now we can run the math backwards and divide the battery’s 12.46  volts by the amperage to find that hot resistance. The bicolor is 12.46 ohms  and the anchor light is around 8.3 ohms. So we have quite a range. The hot  resistance is somewhere between about 4 and 6.25 times the cold resistance.  Worse, Gaetan’s experiment on a bulb meant for mains voltage yielded a 10-fold  difference.  
            Most of you won’t have a box of high current meter movements  laying around. You can do the same thing with a regular voltmeter and a power  resistor, which are only a couple bucks new and can be salvaged from most  equipment with high voltage power supplies. It needs to be a small enough value  that the lamp can still light up. If you’re buying one, I’d go for 8 ohms and 5  amps. 
            Here’s how it works. If you have two resistances in a  circuit, the voltage drops across them will be proportional to the resistances.  If one of those resistances is a normal carbon resistor, its resistance will  not change much as it heats up, so it is easy to measure cold.  
              
            The voltage measurements are made from point A to B for the  lamp (I’m calling this Vl – that’s a lower case “L” for “lamp”, not a one), and  B to C (Vr). Since the voltages are proportional to the resistances: 
            Vr/Vl = Rr/Rl 
            Where  
              Rl = hot resistance of the lamp 
              Rr = resistance of resistor  (measure it to get the exact value) 
            Also measure battery voltage under load while you’re at it,  since you will use it when calculating current. 
            Here’s what the physical setup looked like. I used an 8-ohm  resistor (tested at 8.2 ohms) that I use in place of a speaker for testing  amplifiers. 
            
            Here are a representative set of my results on the bicolor  lamp: 
                        Vl = 7.82 
              Vr = 4.30 
              Rr = 8.2  ohms 
              So…. 
              Rl = 15  ohms 
            We again divide the battery voltage by this resistance to  get current in amps. It comes out to be 0.8 amps. This is somewhat less than  the meter measurement, and likely more accurate. By the same method, the anchor  light is 10.1 ohms and draws about 1.2 amps. Also notice that we ended up  pretty close to Gaétan’s 10-fold difference in resistance, which could be handy  for ballpark estimations based on cold resistance. 
            Amp Hours
            Let’s look back at my sealed lead acid 7 Ah battery. Like I  said, these are designed for a 20-hour discharge cycle at a maximum of .35  amps. To avoid damaging the battery, we would need four batteries in parallel  to run the 1.2 amp anchor light and six to run both lights. This heavy and  inconvenient to me.  
            And you really do need that many batteries. Further evidence of this came up in the above testing.  Even with only the bicolor lamp, 0.8 amps from one battery was causing the  voltage to drop fast enough that it was hard to do the test! I had to hook up  the probes and switch the power on momentarily for each measurement. Otherwise  each measurement would be taken at a radically different battery voltage. With  both batteries in parallel the countdown slowed enough that I could get a  decent measurement – the one found above. 
            Because of this I think we still end up looking at LED  lamps.  
            More on LED Lamps 
            My idea for a white aimed-LED lamp actually uses more power than the incandescent  version, so it is plainly not worth the effort. Granted, it will be brighter,  but perhaps brighter than necessary at 8 Cd. The available LEDs don’t let us  easily make a light in the 4.3 Cd range, so I think we still end up with a  portable light for the white lamp – probably LED.  
            The bicolor, on the other hand, might be worth pursuing.  Using single 120-degree LEDs we could use a power supply of three AA batteries  for 4.5 volts. With the necessary resistors, the entire bicolor unit would  dissipate 154mW. 91mW of that will be mostly light in the LEDs and 63mW will be  heat made in the resistors. Discharge current would be 40mA, which is a pretty  safe range for AA cells as far as I can tell. 
            Still, I only think I would bother with this approach if you  really wanted to use nice-looking fixtures like the retro teardrop nav lights.  The ready-made self-contained units are waterproof and easily interchange among  boats, which has proven to be a real advantage. 
            So even though I think we end up in the same place, I am  deeply grateful to Gaétan for pointing out my error. With any luck this won’t  clue you all in to my nefarious plot to turn you into legion of  proofreaders.  
            Rob Rohde-Szudy 
              Madison,   Wisconsin, USA 
  robrohdeszudy@yahoo.com 
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